Hornet

[Bearcat]

The Hornet needs a thread, this is that thread. Starting off, why does it have a turret with a crew of 1? Is there an expectation that with the Oculus Rift (OR), or otherwise with a view hat button, you're going to be able to slew around and shoot at enemies from High Off Boresight (HOB) angles? Will they add a second crew member? Might Squadron 42 feature any other fighter? Discuss

[Hobbes]

the reason it only has a crew of one and a turret is because the turret turns with the pilots head, so where ever the pilot is looking the turret is pointing the same direction. Of course there is limitations to this i would think, but that is the jist of it.

[Pnuts]

On my tablet so I won't be long winded but I believe you will have the option to either use the OR or a IR device. I think there will also be an option for AI automation similar to how they said the constellation turrets will get.

[Hobbes]

in one of the teaser video's i saw the turret orienting to the same direction as the pilot looked. can't remember which segment/video it was. It is very slight as easy to miss.

[Bearcat]

Pnuts, AI automation would be cool, but it says "Crew: 1", so it's not like an NPC is in there with you. Pure AI/Computer controlled? That's fine too, but it means a lot for the rest of the game. If an in-game AI can control turrets, why not fighters? Or anything else. It's just a discussion point, I suppose. They're still making all of this up as they go.

[Hobbes]

the way a turret will work I am pretty sure is, as i mentioned, it exactly like how the turret (front nose mounted 50 cal) on the AH64D Apache Longbow. The gun points in the same direction as the pilot is looking (in the apache's case it can also be tied to the rear/co pilot).

[Bearcat]

Hobbes, Yeah, that did seem to be how it worked in the demos. Which made me wonder if it's just a HOB capability. That's cool, and a pretty new capability for Chris Roberts' games, if in fact that's how it works. In all of the Wing Commander/Star Lancer games you needed to be facing your enemy to shoot at them.

[Hobbes]

yes but in privateer and freelancer the guns pointed in the same direction as the mouse, which is suppose to be a simulation of guns pointing in the same direction as the pilot is looking.

[Bearcat]

Really? Privateer? I only played it with a joystick, and the crosshairs indicated the direction of the guns. Freelancer...I know a lot of people liked it, but by all indications it was World of Warcraft: In Space. Point-Click-Go make a sandwich. Starlancer featured guns which would swivel to point at an enemy. The "Class 2" weapons seem to fit that description. "Class 4" are the turrets, so presumably they're adding additional capability.

[eNeRGy]

the way a turret will work I am pretty sure is, as i mentioned, it exactly like how the turret (front nose mounted 50 cal) on the AH64D Apache Longbow. The gun points in the same direction as the pilot is looking (in the apache's case it can also be tied to the rear/co pilot).

This makes having an OR/IR very very key to take full advantage of your ship's capabilities.

[Jaxon Corvid]

I predict the best control scheme for the Hornet's turret will be a second monitor and either a hatswitch, or a touchpad/touchscreen.

As I've mentioned before, Windows 8 will soon cause most PC monitors to be touchscreens. I expect that the conversion to touchscreen PC monitors will be well underway by the time Star Citizen is released.

I own a Constellation, not a Hornet, but my ship also has a dorsal turret (and an upgradeable ventral turret). If it's possible, I want to get a small touchscreen monitor that I can position on my left side a few inches in from of my throttle control, so it's within easy reach with my left hand. I should be able to aim the turret with my left index finger and fire it with either my left thumb or a button on my flight stick.

TrackIR sounds incredible and I hope it works, but until I see it in action, I think my touchscreen idea is a better control scheme for a single person to operate a turret while also flying the ship.

[Pnuts]

Ah, back on a PC now.

Anyways, I was referencing this quote here: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/cig/star-citizen/comments?cursor=1730292#comment-1730292

...with the turrets in auto mode...

There is another quote I can't seem to find right now that basically covers this. Its an option available to all turrets, the example used was if your in a hornet with someone on your six, it can fire behind you in auto mode while your flying. He also mentioned it will be no where near as accurate as a human could be. The linked quote above is referencing putting the turrets on the constellation in auto mode while the ship is also in auto mode so you can fly the P52.

I'm personally looking at the DIY IR tracking that is open source using a webcam. Link: http://www.free-track.net/english/

[Bloodzee]

another solution is to lock turret on current selected target then let turret deal with this target while you chase another , or the same target

[Nameless]

In X³: terran conflict, well in the other x games, too, you had various options for a turret. -attack every enemy in range -attack only ships attacking own ship -attack my target -(only) missile defense So all turrets we're AI controlled, sadly the AI is bad, but there are some good scripts to change this and make turrets more powerful

[Bearcat]

They might very well go the automated route. I sort of assumed every turret had to be manned. Wasn't this game supposed to be skill based, with no point-and-click combat?

[Bearcat]

The latest blueprints describe the Hornet's turret as "auto targeting". Good to know.

[Armand12]

Really? Privateer? I only played it with a joystick, and the crosshairs indicated the direction of the guns.

Freelancer...I know a lot of people liked it, but by all indications it was World of Warcraft: In Space. Point-Click-Go make a sandwich.

Starlancer featured guns which would swivel to point at an enemy. The "Class 2" weapons seem to fit that description. "Class 4" are the turrets, so presumably they're adding additional capability.

Class 2 Hard Points are individual guns mounted on a simple flexible hardpoint, based on the designs released thus far, that are capable of approx. 360 rotation, and limited elevation adjustment, they are still technically a "turret," and computer controlled.

Class 4 Hard Points are, in every design thus far, larger 2-gun emplacements capable of full rotation and elevation movement, the hornet has a computer only turret, the constellation has one that is capable of being manned individually or bein computer controlled.

That being said by "computer controlled" I mean the pilot is either aiming them somehow or they are set on an auto-targetting mode.

They might very well go the automated route. I sort of assumed every turret had to be manned. Wasn't this game supposed to be skill based, with no point-and-click combat?

Unless they decide to go with some nice auto-targetting software everything I've read or watched tells me that unless you're a total n00b at multi-tasking, flying, or even vehiculer FPS's, manual targetting will trump auto-targetting every time. Unfortunately, a turret would be practically wasted if it was only able to fire forward unless someone was manually controlling it, and the Hornet was designed to be a one-man fighter with as much firepower as the military could put on it and still have it perform to their specifications. So, yes, turrets in this game will have some auto-targetting features in this game, though it's unlikely that they will ever be given a full modern-day military grade auto-targettin system, more likely it will just be, "track target B, offset 5 degrees in its direction of travel, fire within X00 meters," or some such really basic targetting software, in additition to any point-defense subroutines that may or may not be built in.

[buzby x]

might make sense that the auto is slower than manual, but necessary if you're, say, pulling a tight fast orbit around a large ship and laying into it at a right angle for extended periods of time. you have to watch where you're flying

[Bearcat]

Class 2 Hard Points are individual guns mounted on a simple flexible hardpoint, based on the designs released thus far, that are capable of approx. 360 rotation, and limited elevation adjustment, they are still technically a "turret," and computer controlled.

Can you give an example of where this was used in a previous skill-based dogfighter, or mentioned by a SC developer? My expectation is that these flexible turrets will have something like 10-60 degrees of swivel in X and Y axis, and will either be aimed by the pilot (less likely) or automatically lead your target, but you still have to pull the trigger yourself.

[Pnuts]

Can you give an example of where this was used in a previous skill-based dogfighter, or mentioned by a SC developer? My expectation is that these flexible turrets will have something like 10-60 degrees of swivel in X and Y axis, and will either be aimed by the pilot (less likely) or automatically lead your target, but you still have to pull the trigger yourself.

If you look at the released info on the 300i, the Class 2 under the pilots seat better matches your description then Armand12's

[Armand12]

Can you give an example of where this was used in a previous skill-based dogfighter, or mentioned by a SC developer? My expectation is that these flexible turrets will have something like 10-60 degrees of swivel in X and Y axis, and will either be aimed by the pilot (less likely) or automatically lead your target, but you still have to pull the trigger yourself.

Personally, I imagine both will be true/possible depending on you're own personal settings of the fly-by-wire avionics simulation that they are creating, as there are scenarios for either possiblity being more effective. I also believe that each and every ship design will have its own unique capabilities even down to the placement/layout of turrets, I only say that class 2 hardpoints have 360 rotation because in all visible examples there are no apparent stops on the turret itself. Of course this is all conjecture based simply upon my observations of the released designs, and I sincerely doubt that the mobility of the turrets will be limited to just what's easy to use in a dogfight scenario.

[Bearcat]

"New" Hornet art, posted on RSI forums. I have no idea of the source or how long it has been around:

[Shane]

For the whole turret thing i'll be using Track iR for it so wont be a problem for me. For those who don't i they might have to micro manage or not have and switch it for the cargo space among other things.

[modo0419]

I expect it will be like the Apache and Raptor FCS where it is slaved to the pilot/CPG headset. For the Raptor the headset slaves missile locks (I think it's specifically for laser-guided), for the Apache, the CPG helmet and eyepiece controls the 30mm cannon.

 

Another overlooked piece of hardware that might be nice for this is the Razer Nostromo, the thumbstick could control turrets. and multiple programmable keys for certain funtions, think easy-assignment of chaff, flares, ecm, radar suites... etc.

[zerkerz]

Anyone that would like a "racer" hornet? Not like a racer but a faster combat spaceship with more agility and speed.  And more "race" look into it. I would adore a ship like that with twin engines and the intakes be more aero dynamic, thighter/closer too the ship