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Star Guides | Joysticks & HOTAS


Byronyk

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Nice video :)  i want to buy one do badly 

 

I own the Logitech Extreme 3D pro. I plan on seeing how that handles and the KB+Mouse before I make an upgrade decision. Depending on what Chris Roberts says on the SC specific peripherals, i'll either wait for that or eventually pick up the X55. 

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I'm quite torn on what to do, but this video puts it a bit in perspective. Thank you @Byronyk!

I'm actually lacking a joystick at the moment, but I'd like to have one for alpha and beta and I have a feeling that SC-specific peripherals will come along when the PU is officially launched. I'm stuck in between buying something now and waiting, but waiting means that alpha and beta practice will go down the drain, which would suck... Decisions, decisions.

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I'm quite torn on what to do, but this video puts it a bit in perspective. Thank you @Byronyk!

I'm actually lacking a joystick at the moment, but I'd like to have one for alpha and beta and I have a feeling that SC-specific peripherals will come along when the PU is officially launched. I'm stuck in between buying something now and waiting, but waiting means that alpha and beta practice will go down the drain, which would suck... Decisions, decisions.

 

My suggestion to your specific situation would be to pick up the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro. It's cheap and you can use it till the SC specific gear comes out (and then hold onto it as a spare just-in-case)

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I was thinking about that, but I'm worried about getting my reflexes honed with that particular joystick and then switching to something different when it matters (PU is live). I had the same issue with my steering wheel and Gran Turismo (had a cheap one for the GT5 Prologue, got used to it, and then sucked the big one until I got used to the proper steering wheel that I bought when the actual GT5 game was launched).

 

Thanks for the tips though! I'll keep it in mind and try to make a decision before the DFM. Maybe we will have more news on SC-specific peripherals until then.

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@Mordraed Keep in mind CR has stated KB+M will be competitive as well, so don't feel obligated to buy a Joystick/HOTAS. That's one of the main reasons I bought a cheap (but good) joystick -- I want to test how the Joystick vs. KB+M feels in the DFM. Based on that, I'll make another decision if I want to upgrade.

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I watched your video a couple of hours ago Byronyk, as im quite tempted by the X52 Pro, however i dont really bother with flight sims and likewise space till SC came along. Im planning on taking a similar approach, wait for the DFM and see how KB+M feels and whether I even *like* (or want) to fly, cos what initially sold me on the game was being able to jump in with someone else and work together, cos if im expected to fly (thinking dogfighting initially) then im not interested.

 

In about 10-12 days I've gone from not bothering with SC beyond following it and being in awe of what its trying to achieve (but not being interested in space games/film/tv to play it) to buying an Aurora & Starfarer, and wanting a HOTAS & Rift before its released.

 

The Logitech stick was the first thing i thought about, im a big fan of their support, and although you mentioned (iirc) it was $27 on Amazon, here in the UK the cheapest ive seen it from a reputable site (and new) is £39 ($62.40) from Amazon.co.uk also, but $45-50 being the typical price. At that point, its not quite the cheap fix till you bite the bullet and buy a proper solution. The X52 can be bought for about £80, the Pro for £110-125, so 2x or 3x more, but a considerably better product.

$27 vs $130 (X52P @amazon), its a reasonable difference at 1/5th the price. $62 vs $176 is a sizable waste of money which could have been used on a far better product. Its a real shame, because the point you make about the Logi 3D stick is valid, but possibly not so much outside North America due to shipping & 'lets exploit the Europeans' tactics.

I have a feeling that any official accessories will be similar to other branded accessories, price about 20% more than its really worth without the branding, then add shipping (whether thats from RSI or distribution) it'll end up in the $250-300 range by the time its in the UK for what started off as a $150-175 product.

The DFM is going to be the biggest influence, and i'll probably take the plunge and get an X52 Pro.

I also want to thank you for doing that 6min video, it nicely puts all the prominant info in there without too much or too little info, i've used it when telling friends about it, along with the trailer video. Im certain ive watched a good 24h worth of SC videos in just 10-12 days and thats definitely been the most useful. Hopefully it leads to more funds raised for RSI.

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Great video and very informative.  I've used HOTAS setups in the past and for a space sim with keyboard controls for chat and god knows what else, I think it might be overkill.  So I want to try dual stick setup as I expect I'll have my hands on the keyboard most of the time, and won't need to  be constantly adjusting my flight controls unless I'm in combat or need to avoid something.  I've heard the CH Sticks are good for dual stick setups.  Do you know if the logitech 3d extreme will work in dual stick setups?  Could I pair the logitech as my right stick and something like the ambidextrous CH Flightstick Pro in my left?

 

CH Flightstick Pro

 

CH Combat Stick

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@PaulC2K I appreciate the kind words. Yeah, I only included prices in USD. I considered looking up the prices for the EU and AUS, but in the end I figured they would all scale price-wise based on their overall quality. I'm also right there with you about the SC specific gear -- I expect a pretty big markup for the name, but we'll have to see. If you are planning on buying the X52 now, I'd recommend buying the X55-Rhino (if you have the extra cash) since it came out early.

 

@Bambaataa I honestly have never used a dual stick setup. Perhaps someone else can offer advice on this!

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Sometimes it is easier than you think with Euro prices.

 

55 Rhino Price Amazon.com = 199 Dollars

 

55 Rhino Price Amazon.de = 199 Euros

 

Now you'd think it is because of the VAT they have to include automatically but that would only be true if we had 37% but we have 19%. Unfortunately we are used to paying more for stuff. I mean it could be worse though, we could have Australian prices for games :)

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I have been putting some thought into trying out a joystick for this game. This video gives me an idea to work off of. I'm not quite dead-set on a joystick yet, but I want the option to try it out when the dogfighting module comes out.  I think I am going to look at either the Logitech 3D Pro or the Thrustmaster T-Flight.

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@PaulC2K I appreciate the kind words. Yeah, I only included prices in USD. I considered looking up the prices for the EU and AUS, but in the end I figured they would all scale price-wise based on their overall quality. I'm also right there with you about the SC specific gear -- I expect a pretty big markup for the name, but we'll have to see. If you are planning on buying the X52 now, I'd recommend buying the X55-Rhino (if you have the extra cash) since it came out early.

 

I wouldnt say you need to bother getting worldwide/regional pricing, your producing a guide so the product is pretty much what people want opinions on and then they'll figure out whats best for them.

The X52 is a bit out of my price range, let alone the pro or X55. I've paid far more for racing wheels, because ive known it'll be worth it as i love sim racing, but i cant think of a single space flight sim ive played, and likewise regular flying games (sim or casual). So im going to have to see what i think of the dogfighting module with KB+M and get an idea as to whether i like flying. If i do, then it'll provide the justification for a X52/pro but the X55 would have to drop about 20-25% to consider. Hopefully bitcoin prices will go back up again.

 

One thing I was wondering, these flight sticks are good for flying obviously, but what about crewing and FPS, am i going to need space for [stick] [kb] [mouse] [stick]? cos that doesnt seem particularly comfortable for flying. Unless i buy a new kb with less buttons i never use anyway (original Logi G15 atm). Maybe i could slide the kb further back but its still going to feel weird i think. Joypad? not a big fan for FPS (SP maybe, MP no).

What are peoples plans for dealing with flight and on-foot/FPS aspects?

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One thing I was wondering, these flight sticks are good for flying obviously, but what about crewing and FPS, am i going to need space for [stick] [kb] [mouse] [stick]? cos that doesnt seem particularly comfortable for flying. Unless i buy a new kb with less buttons i never use anyway (original Logi G15 atm). Maybe i could slide the kb further back but its still going to feel weird i think. Joypad? not a big fan for FPS (SP maybe, MP no).

What are peoples plans for dealing with flight and on-foot/FPS aspects?

 

For everything but flying, a M+KB will be the way to go. While that might be bold to say, I don't see FPS combat, interacting with NPCs planet side, and running around your ship micromanaging systems optimal with a joystick. Could it be done? Possibly. 

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I'm still saving up for the Hornet I want, the necessary computer hardware to support Alpha and Beta, so it's nice to see that when I eventually get around to it, some of the budget or economy set ups still perform well - thanks for helpin us all out! I agree about the M+KB though. For PC Gamers, while it may be possible, not many have experience using Joysticks to control human characters. 

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CH product Combo (joystick + Throttle) is very nice ( I have bought this combo maybe 8 years ago and it is still perfectly working!)

i don't feel like in my daily bird (Mirage 2000), but it's ok.

 

in addition, a Logitech g13 for right hand (I know it is a left hand device but there is my throttle)  to control avionics and you can  focus on your screen + forget your keyboard.

 

This is my set-up

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@Byronyk I wonder if you have personally used Logitech Extreme 3D Pro, that you praised in the video, and here's why. I've recently undergone a tedious procedure of picking a new joystick for myself and the reason I even needed a new one is that I couldn't use my previous model anymore. See, most of the budget joysticks nowadays (Extreme 3D Pro included) depend on variable resistors for the pitch capture, which are notoriously short-lived. In order to work properly they need regular cleaning and oiling and in time they wear out completely, so you'd have to either replace them or throw your joystick away. And it's not distant future I'm talking about, oh no! Judging from my experience (as well as a couple of my acquaintances') it is not after 1.5 - 2 months of casual use that you'll notice certain deviations, like random off-centering, refusal to register extreme tilt positions and that ever present "noize". The symptoms will rapidly become more distinct until you are completely unable to play. Now, I haven't tested that particular model, but out of curiosity I've browsed some forums and have found those regular complaints regarding Extreme 3D Pro. Sure, a deal of 27 USD sounds nice, but to everyone who decides to take it - a word of warning: if you plan to actively participate in DFM battles, you'd better know how to use a screwdriver.

 

However, an alternative to this would be joysticks based around the Hall effect sensors. These are not subject to mechanical wear and therefore last much longer. They also provide much better accuracy in pitch capture, but are generally more expensive. Two cheapest models utilizing Hall effect, that I was able to find are these: Defender Cobra M5 and Thrustmaster T-16000M. Exact prices vary greatly depending on the region, so I see no point in naming my local ones. All I can say is they are quite affordable. I'm not a hardcore fan of flight simulators, so my main requirements for the joystick were a) durability B) decent amount of programmable buttons and c) low price. I chose the T-16000M model partly because I was familiar with Thrustmaster brand, partly because it was easier to get and partly because it had more of a "spacy" look. :) Anyways, as far as I can tell it met my specifications perfectly. T-16000M is a sturdy stick customizable for right- or left-handed use. It has 12 buttons and a throttle slider laid out on the base, 4 on the stick itself and 8-position hat on top. The stick has 3 axes and offers an adequate amout of resistance for smooth targeting and centering. My only cavil right now is that T-16000M was apparently designed for a bigger hand. As a result, a person with, say, medium-sized mitts could have a non-optimal grip and possibly would have to reposition his/her whole hand for a comfortable access to different buttons. Also, wouldn't qualify it as a drawback yet, but the buttons on the base feel a little unresponsive. I always have a feeling that they might stay in a pressed position. Not sure if they will last... Apart from that, I would definitely recommend it for purchase, since I've tested it for about a month now in different warplane and space sims with great success.

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@Byronyk I wonder if you have personally used Logitech Extreme 3D Pro, that you praised in the video

 

I don't mind being called out, so here ya go. 

 

 

fQ5GzPl.jpg?1

 

On a serious note, your concerns are unfounded. Anecdotal evidence to support quick wear-tare really doesn't mean much. I could say easily that many people on these forums and the official RSI forums said they've had the Logitech for years and have had zero problems. I'm not trying to saying the T-16000 is a bad choice, it's very good in fact. I'm just saying you need more to backup your claim on the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro.

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