Jump to content
Psychomorph

The "Origin 300i" thread

Recommended Posts

Fellow 300i purchaser, here. I'm really excited for it. The specs show that it should have the same top-speed as the Hornet (same TR4 thruster on the back) and maybe even greater maneuverability (12 TR1 thrusters v Hornet's 8 TR2's). Besides that the main difference is the lack of missile capability on the 300i, but 2 more tonnes of cargo space. Engine has two modifier spots and 6 overall upgrade capacity, so we'll definitely be able to customize and upgrade it to fit our playstyles. I'm not too concerned about how it'll look. All the ships so far look great to me. I think the 300i is the perfect starter ship: simple enough to not be too much to handle right at the start, but with enough upgrade-ability that you can grow with it, too.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

It has 2 class 4 hard points as I recall. However that would mean sacrificing turrets which is something you probably don't want to do.

You're probably right that guns would be more useful on turrets than missile launchers, because energy weapons have unlimited ammo, whereas missiles are very limited.

However, don't under-estimate a missile launcher turret's ability to fire missiles backwards. That ability should make the Origin -- and any ship with a turret -- a great blockade runner. Meaning if you're alone and are attacked by one or more pirates, you could simply try to outrun them, instead of fighting them. If they pursued you, you could fire missiles backwards at them, and they'd have to veer away to avoid them -- or get a missile up their nose -- which should cause them to lag behind, enabling you to get away.

Admittedly, this tactic is just a theory at this point. But I'm interested in experimenting with weapon loadouts and seeing if missile launcher turrets are effective.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, but you're assuming that you could even put a missile launcher on that functions as a turret. Such a missile launcher would be larger and more advanced than one that just fires in one direction and a ship as small as the 300i may not support that sophisticated of a missile launcher.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, but you're assuming that you could even put a missile launcher on that functions as a turret. Such a missile launcher would be larger and more advanced than one that just fires in one direction and a ship as small as the 300i may not support that sophisticated of a missile launcher.

You might be right. But in the Star Citizen Ships Development Doc it states: "Turret slots can also mount pylon-type weapons (i.e. a tractor beam or a chaff dispenser.)" I know it doesn't specifically state that a turret can be equipped with missile launchers -- but it doesn't say they can't either.

I'm hoping I can equip missile launchers on my Constellation's ventral turret.

I understand your point that the 300i might not be able to, since it's much smaller than the Constellation. However, since the 300i doesn't have any Class 3 weapon mounts, the only way it could have missiles is if they were mounted in its turrets.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You might be right. But in the Star Citizen Ships Development Doc it states: "Turret slots can also mount pylon-type weapons (i.e. a tractor beam or a chaff dispenser.)" I know it doesn't specifically state that a turret can be equipped with missile launchers -- but it doesn't say they can't either.

I'm hoping I can equip missile launchers on my Constellation's ventral turret.

I understand your point that the 300i might not be able to, since it's much smaller than the Constellation. However, since the 300i doesn't have any Class 3 weapon mounts, the only way it could have missiles is if they were mounted in its turrets.

Ah, but you see it doesn't have turrets, it has 2 Class 4 hard points. Those aren't by default turrets, they're just a section of hull that is built to be able to house turrets. You can put anything there really, as long as the ship supports the device.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah, but you see it doesn't have turrets, it has 2 Class 4 hard points. Those aren't by default turrets, they're just a section of hull that is built to be able to house turrets. You can put anything there really, as long as the ship supports the device.

This is the text from the Weapon Hardpoints section of the SCSDD:

HARDPOINTS

Every ship has hardpoints on which a variety of different weapons can be mounted. Each hardpoint has a classification. A lower classification can always be mounted on a higher classification hardpoint, but not the other way around.

CLASS 1: Fixed Gun. This is your standard forward facing laser, neutron cannon, particle gun, etc.

CLASS 2: Articulated Gun. Think the guns in Freelancer or the smart weapons found in later Wing Commanders. Class 2 hardpoints are rarer and more expensive, but they allow guns to rotate on an arc rather than fire point blank.

CLASS 3: Pylon. This is where you mount missiles, ECM units, radar pods, drop tanks, additional ammunition, special scanners, etc.

CLASS 4: Turret. Uses the same fixed guns as class 1, but mounted in a separate area of the ship which may be crewed by another person. Turret slots can also mount pylon-type weapons (i.e. a tractor beam or a chaff dispenser.)

Class 4 is specifically referred to as a TURRET -- meaning it IS, by default, a turret. It also states that a turret can mount pylon-type weapons. It doesn't qualify that with "some" or "only certain" pylon-type weapons. That implies it can mount any and all pylon-type weapons, including missiles.

I think we'll have to find another source to resolve this discussion, because the wording is somewhat ambiguous. And considering the document wasn't thoroughly proof-read, it's possible it isn't 100% accurate.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're missing my point. It's not saying that you can add a weapon to the turret and suddenly have a swivveling version of that weapon. It's saying that instead of a turret you can put a lower class piece of equipment there. Thing is, if that piece of equipment you put there doesn't swivel like a turret does then it's not suddenly going to gain the ability to swivel just because it's attached to a Class 4 hardpoint.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Which is why I'd rather stick with my turrets because I won't be constantly worried about running out of missiles. And if I want to focus on speed, maybe I'll leave the turrets off to keep my weight down and my speed up. But, if I wanted to, I could add countermeasures like "ASD Chaff Auto-Dispenser Countermeasures" or "Joker XB-44 “TomatoCan” (IR or HS/HE Frag)" (might be a mine of somekind) that could do some of the things you're saying with the rear-facing missiles. Either block their fire or attack them passive-aggressively. Also, are we sure the turrets even swivel? RSI says "CLASS 4: Turret. Uses the same fixed guns as class 1, but mounted in a separate area of the ship". Kinda makes me think they're just more forward facing fire-power. It says they can be manned, but the 300i's a one-man, so that won't be the case here.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Which is why I'd rather stick with my turrets because I won't be constantly worried about running out of missiles. And if I want to focus on speed, maybe I'll leave the turrets off to keep my weight down and my speed up.

But, if I wanted to, I could add countermeasures like "ASD Chaff Auto-Dispenser Countermeasures" or "Joker XB-44 “TomatoCan” (IR or HS/HE Frag)" (might be a mine of somekind) that could do some of the things you're saying with the rear-facing missiles. Either block their fire or attack them passive-aggressively.

Also, are we sure the turrets even swivel? RSI says "CLASS 4: Turret. Uses the same fixed guns as class 1, but mounted in a separate area of the ship". Kinda makes me think they're just more forward facing fire-power. It says they can be manned, but the 300i's a one-man, so that won't be the case here.

If they didn't swivel to some degree then they wouldn't be turrets.

Also, not being able to man them probably won't be a problem. You can likely set them to auto fire.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

You're missing my point.

It's not saying that you can add a weapon to the turret and suddenly have a swivveling version of that weapon. It's saying that instead of a turret you can put a lower class piece of equipment there. Thing is, if that piece of equipment you put there doesn't swivel like a turret does then it's not suddenly going to gain the ability to swivel just because it's attached to a Class 4 hardpoint.

As I said, the wording is too ambiguous to draw conclusions.

Regardless, I see no reason why missile launchers cannot be mounted on turrets, because an external missile pod would probably be the same size and mass as a cannon, or any of the other pylon-mounted weapons.

The fact that a tractor beam is classified as a Class 3 pylon-type weapons, but can be mounted on a Class 4 hardpoint, implies that it can be mounted in a turret. A tractor beam would be much more effective at snaring ships if it was installed in a turret than on a pylon with a limited arc. I cannot imagine how a Cutlass could keep a ship secured in its tractor beam and board it using its docking collar if the tractor beam was mounted on a fixed forward-facing pylon. The Cutlass can't board the ship from the rear. It would have to pull alongside the ship (or above or below it) to attach the docking collar. When it did that, a fixed-forward tractor beam would probably lose its grip on the target ship, enabling it to escape (unless its engines were disabled). Whereas a tractor beam mounted on a turret could keep a target ship secured so it could be boarded.

If tractoring and boarding ships didn't work this way, then pirates would need at least two ships to capture a ship: one to tractor it and the other to board it. That seems contrary to the whole concept of the Cutlass, which is a ship that a lone wolf pirate can use to capture other ships.

I, and A LOT of other players, would be very, VERY disappointed if tractor beams didn't work this way.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

IMO class 4 hardpoints are two things: an actual space on the hull of the ship and a power hook-up. I don't think that there is already two Lazy Susans that we can load whatever we want to into them just so they can spin. The modules we load into them can be uni- or multi-directional, the hardpoint doesn't seem to determine that. For example, the class 2 hardpoints are for articulated guns; those move, but if you put a class 1 fixed weapon on there, it won't automatically make it articulated. Same with class 4 hardpoints. The module determines articulation, not the hardpoint. That being said, I doubt the tractor beams are uni-directional. You are correct in saying that it wouldn't make sense if they only faced forwards, none of the ships so far have docking collars in the front. Also, a ship must be completely disabled to board (engines, shield, etc.) That is why CR said it would take skill to board another ship, not just the right ship modules.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Think I would fin head tracking turrets more helpful than missiles. Hopefully the cockpit will be shaped in a way so a 360 field of view is possible. Then one would be able to shoot at ship coming up your six by just "turning" your head. Think this would be great using the Occulus :)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Think I would fin head tracking turrets more helpful than missiles. Hopefully the cockpit will be shaped in a way so a 360 field of view is possible.

Then one would be able to shoot at ship coming up your six by just "turning" your head.

Think this would be great using the Occulus :)

Unless you're an owl, you can't turn your head 180-degrees, so you couldn't see an enemy ship at your six to shoot them with the turret.

Most flight sims will only allow the player to look around 270-degrees, because it's physically impossible for a pilot to look directly behind them while strapped into their seats -- and the seat headrest and other parts of the plane block their view anyway.

While I was impressed by the trailer that showed the Hornet's turret aiming in the direction the pilot was looking, I'd prefer the option of mapping it to a hatswitch instead, so I could swivel it around and shoot directly behind my ship. Ideally, I could use a second monitor to display the turret's view and aim using the hatswitch while contining to fly my ship.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seriously I have a swivel chair :lol:

I'm sure you know that's not how it works. The pilot's vision will almost certainly be controlled by a hatswitch on the flight stick, just like every flight/combat sim.

The only exception might be with the Oculus Rift -- but it's my understanding that even it has limitations.

I predict that the most effective way to operate turrets will be to have crew members operate them, not the pilot. It would be overwhelming for the pilot.

The pilot of a starfighter, like the Hornet, would probably only use the turret to fire in a forward 180-degree arc, not backwards. After all, most of the Hornet's weapons are fixed-forward, including its missiles. If you focus too much on the turret you're liable to miss what is right in front you -- like a Vanduul Scythe about to ram your ship!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now


×