Drake Interplanetary Caterpillar revealed

[Devil Khan]

Oh yeah, but even he said they didn't have any idea just were messing around trying to see which fits best, anyway they are not using the actual module, but the main crew "quarters" type stuff.

Also, There was a brief mention about how difficult it is from loaded and unloaded and the center of mass moves up a lot and with the set 5(4+1) modules. Now try it again with 2-15 modules and you will burn your own engines out. Anyway it's fixed at 5 Which is large anyway.

Personally, I like my Cater pillar as it stands. Granted a few "iffy" placements. Namely a center lined walk way instead of left side. More cargo space really and better looking. I know there is a little high difference from the cross walkway and the walkway on the modules.

[FoxChard]

Now, I think everyone is correct on the same point here. 

There were Caterpillar modules in the works two years ago when that ATV dropped; however, there has been very little to no word on them since. If I were to make a spurious and poor guess, I'd say we'll need to wait until at least next spring (with Carrack and BMM coming out) before we hear again about Caterpillar modules. 

And the Retaliator? That thing is just a lulz boat. For it to remain viable versus the Polaris and the Eclipse...well...its gonna need way more than six torpedoes. 

*Edit: viable in the sense that anyone would actually pick it to fly one as a bomber. Sure it looks cool, but for each fully crewed Tali, you lock up a significant portion of the crew of a Polaris, or multiple crews for Eclipses. It just doesn't make sense anymore. It punches way below its weight.

[Devil Khan]

Tali used to have size 1 turrets, but max size 4 now afaik. Anyway I hope they have been fixed. 

Eclipse won't fit in either Polaris or Idris unfortunately.

[Reavern]

On 7/20/2017 at 9:47 AM, Devil Khan said:

Oh yeah, but even he said they didn't have any idea just were messing around trying to see which fits best, anyway they are not using the actual module, but the main crew "quarters" type stuff.

Also, There was a brief mention about how difficult it is from loaded and unloaded and the center of mass moves up a lot and with the set 5(4+1) modules. Now try it again with 2-15 modules and you will burn your own engines out. Anyway it's fixed at 5 Which is large anyway.

Personally, I like my Cater pillar as it stands. Granted a few "iffy" placements. Namely a center lined walk way instead of left side. More cargo space really and better looking. I know there is a little high difference from the cross walkway and the walkway on the modules.

Placing the catwalk in the centre of the cargo modules is a terrible idea, and very unimaginative. (I suspect you're one of those ship symmetry fetishists.) It's a bad idea because it would block taller objects or stacked containers from being carried. CIG made a smart design choice by placing the catwalk on the port side, because tall cargo can be loaded from the starboard side door. Also, it's much easier to deploy and land Dragonflies without an overhanging catwalk in the middle. If a player flew too high on takeoff or landing they'd lose their heads. BAD IDEA!!!

The Cat wouldn't "burn out" its engines if it had a variable number of modules. It would just accelerate and decelerate faster or slower based on the ship's mass. It's no different than an empty ship versus a ship laden with cargo. CIG has said that they plan to include realistic flight physics based on cargo; they just haven't implemented it yet (because there's no cargo yet!).

On 7/20/2017 at 11:00 AM, FoxChard said:

Now, I think everyone is correct on the same point here. 

There were Caterpillar modules in the works two years ago when that ATV dropped; however, there has been very little to no word on them since. If I were to make a spurious and poor guess, I'd say we'll need to wait until at least next spring (with Carrack and BMM coming out) before we hear again about Caterpillar modules. 

And the Retaliator? That thing is just a lulz boat. For it to remain viable versus the Polaris and the Eclipse...well...its gonna need way more than six torpedoes. 

*Edit: viable in the sense that anyone would actually pick it to fly one as a bomber. Sure it looks cool, but for each fully crewed Tali, you lock up a significant portion of the crew of a Polaris, or multiple crews for Eclipses. It just doesn't make sense anymore. It punches way below its weight.

I disagree that CIG has abandoned the Cat modules or placed them on the back burner. It doesn't make sense for CIG to complete all the work on the Cat's interior, but stop short of producing the modules. That's like halting construction of a house before finishing the kitchen and bathroom. The CIG would want a consistent style for the Cat and its modules, which means making them all together. If they didn't, who knows if the same ship designers and artists would still be working at CIG next year? Or they might be working on different ships and it would be difficult to get the band back together. Stopping and starting like that would be extremely inefficient. And considering how long it took for CIG to finally get to the Caterpillar, I doubt they stopped halfway through.

I suspect that CIG has finished the modules, but is withholding them because they don't serve a purpose ATM. After 3.0 is released, we'll see if CIG releases the Caterpillar Modules.

The Retaliator will definitely be redesigned. I think the whole interior is going to be changed, and some of the exterior too. I think the VTOL thrusters are going to be scrapped. They sorta made sense at the time, but are excessive now. If the Caterpillar and Starfarer can takeoff and land on planets without large VTOL thrusters, WHY would the Retaliator need them? The Tali could takeoff and land like a large plane using a runway on planets, and VTOL from carriers and stations in space.

Regardless, the Tali's interior should be the primary focus. The layout is terrible, even for a utilitarian military ship. The crew quarters and escape pods are on the top half-deck that is only accessible via a single ladder at the front. In an emergency, the payload master and gunners would be better off jumping out the bomb bay doors than trying to reach the escape pods. Most importantly, the bomb bays are ridiculously inefficient. They take up so much room and only hold 6 torpedoes. What is the point of the rotary launcher if it only holds two torpedoes!? The Tali's torpedo capacity has to increased to 12 to make it a viable heavy bomber to differentiate it from the Harbinger and Eclipse.

On 7/20/2017 at 1:16 PM, Devil Khan said:

Tali used to have size 1 turrets, but max size 4 now afaik. Anyway I hope they have been fixed. 

Eclipse won't fit in either Polaris or Idris unfortunately.

The Eclipse does fit inside the Idris. It was specifically designed to fit inside the Idris and CIG said it does. CIG said that Eclipse can't (currently) fit inside the Polaris' hangar bay. However, the Polaris' design hasn't been finalized yet and it isn't even close to being flyable. Large ships typically grow during production, and CIG will modify the Polaris' hangar bay to accommodate the Eclipse.

[Devil Khan]

You seem to be missing the fact that every one has a center lined "ground/base" level on the ship. Nothing can be put over head. The upper levels are to the left which takes up further space. 

I'm not even going to mention the 15 modules with you as your arguments are flawed and irrelevant as it was stated the max and min number is 5 4+1 nose

[GeraldEvans]

The Cat isn't symmetrical down the middle on any level and that's a good thing for exactly the reasons Reavern mentioned. The tractor beam room is on the starboard side as is the most unimpeded side of each cargo bay. By having the catwalk on one side, it creates the largest total volume an object can be before being interfered with by the catwalk. You don't have to like it, but that doesn't diminish its advantages.

[FoxChard]

Do you guys thing the observation window / crew station in the nose of the command module (lower level) is another tractor beam station? Right now its just a cool panel with a great view.

[GeraldEvans]

Yes.

[Devil Khan]

Yup tractor beam on either side. However the one on the wing really 2-3 ish modules. think it's too high to see directly down

[Reavern]

2 hours ago, Devil Khan said:

You seem to be missing the fact that every one has a center lined "ground/base" level on the ship. Nothing can be put over head. The upper levels are to the left which takes up further space. 

I'm not even going to mention the 15 modules with you as your arguments are flawed and irrelevant as it was stated the max and min number is 5 4+1 nose

Your post in unintelligible. It doesn't even seem like you've seen the interior of the Caterpillar. FYI here it is:

Look at how much height the Cat's cargo bay has thanks to the catwalk being located on the port side. If the catwalk ran along the centreline, it would be over the door on the lower deck, and cut off half the cargo bay. A centreline catwalk would make it impossible to move a tall object from one side of the cargo bay to the other. The object would have to be moved out the side door and carried around the ship to the opposite side door to place it on that side. It would be ludicrously inefficient!

Fortunately, CIG has far more sense than you do, and they aren't slaves to symmetrical ship designs -- obviously, because the Caterpillar is an asymmetrical ship design, in case you hadn't noticed. 

You're just being a sycophant by saying that CIG has chosen to limit the Caterpillar to 5 modules, no more, no less, and that's the way it is, and always will be. You clearly don't understand that these ship forum threads are for DISCUSSION, expression of ideas and opinions, speculation, and theorycrafting. Not just paroting everything that CIG posts on RSI. That would be pointless!

Just because the Caterpillar is currently limited to 5 cargo modules doesn't mean that will always be the case. Ships have changed and been updated numerous times already, in part because backers have expressed suggestions and constructive criticisms about their designs. And there have always been close-minded sycophants like you who have argued against change, shouting "NO! The ship is perfect the way CIG designed it. It will NEVER EVER NEVER NEVER EVER NEVER be changed!" Then the ship changes and you don't say anything. Until someone criticizes the redesign and then you shout, "SHUT UP! The new ship is perfect the way CIG designed it. It will NEVER EVER NEVER..." 

You lack imagination.

[FoxChard]

I think what he is saying is that on the lower level there is a walkway, and that CIG may not let you stack boxes on it. I dunno, we'll find out soon.

Edit-While I think it would be cool for the Cat to get more modules, I hope it doesn't atm. That 'super' cat would be enabled to compete with the Hull C/Merchantman level ships. I think instead of making the Cat look silly, they really should just design another transport ship altogether. I'd like it to be human (none of this alien technology gimmick stuff) with all internal stowage. A purpose built ship would A) Look much better, B ) Perform much better in their flight model than the super cat, and C) would give the haters of the Hulls something to gravitate to. There is much to be said for having a classic sci-fi style bulk carrier.

[Devil Khan]

They won't allow direct access on lower level and upper. The floors left and right will allow to move out. Also, I did state that the walkway and on the floor differ too much to use unless it was a major rework on the several rooms, which it never going to happen.

[FoxChard]

Devil, I have no idea what you're trying to say man.

Back to my own ranting, however. I like to hear myself talk.

About the asymmetry, I doubt we'll see very many more of them. CIG's concept guys obviously want them in because they're cool.

All (both? Just the cat and jav?) of the asymmetric ships predate the current flight model, indeed, I think they all go back to 2013 or earlier. I think it was in that Cat video I posted earlier, but they were encountering problems with the Asymmetric vessels because you still need to maintain an even distribution of mass across the ship because of physics. So despite the often trotted out argument that aerodynamics don't matter in space, mass distribution still does.

Hence, despite HUGE community support we didn't get the correct Herald. The Cat survives because it is basically a foundation ship, as is the Javelin and the outrage would have been nightmarish. The Cat probably compensates because the command module is literally coated in maneuvering thrusters and because the starboard wing is fairly large and roomy. The Jav can be balanced because it has a hangar with extra reinforcements and the ship elevator/door thing. I'm expecting the Mustangs to change somewhat as well because they're are basically magicked into working correctly. 

[Reavern]

19 minutes ago, FoxChard said:

Devil, I have no idea what you're trying to say man.

Back to my own ranting, however. I like to hear myself talk.

About the asymmetry, I doubt we'll see very many more of them. CIG's concept guys obviously want them in because they're cool.

All (both? Just the cat and jav?) of the asymmetric ships predate the current flight model, indeed, I think they all go back to 2013 or earlier. I think it was in that Cat video I posted earlier, but they were encountering problems with the Asymmetric vessels because you still need to maintain an even distribution of mass across the ship because of physics. So despite the often trotted out argument that aerodynamics don't matter in space, mass distribution still does.

Hence, despite HUGE community support we didn't get the correct Herald. The Cat survives because it is basically a foundation ship, as is the Javelin and the outrage would have been nightmarish. The Cat probably compensates because the command module is literally coated in maneuvering thrusters and because the starboard wing is fairly large and roomy. The Jav can be balanced because it has a hangar with extra reinforcements and the ship elevator/door thing. I'm expecting the Mustangs to change somewhat as well because they're are basically magicked into working correctly. 

No, the Javelin wasn't an original Kickstarter ship. It was revealed November 27, 2014, as part of the 2014 Anniversary Sale.

I understand asymmetric ship designs can (and should) be more challenging to flight model with realistic physics, but that doesn't mean that they're bad ship designs or SC shouldn't have them. They should be more challenging to fly. That's a good thing! It means unskilled pilots won't use the Cat. Or they'll crash and die. I'm okay with that.

I don't expect all ship to be asymmetrical, but there should be some in Star Citizen. And there are, thankfully! Has no one seen the Vanduul Scythe!?

[GeraldEvans]

Don't get me started on the Orion... [emoji34]

[FoxChard]

Lol, forgot the Scythe that thing flies on pure magic power.. I'm not saying that they shouldn't be in the game, I'm just saying that CIG is unlikely to make many more of them. They're unpredictable going from cool concept stage to cool flyable stage.

[Devil Khan]

Look, I am not arguing about how bad it is. I've had one since they first were flyable. I stated that there wasn't a quick change as there was a different level. The ship is perfect in it's form. Now stop your bickering.  

Ever think if there was only one door either side instead of two of each module. The only reason I could think was the forward module and access to the turret, which can be changed around. Anyway, what's done is done and I am an owner of a Cater Pillar.

people who call them cats at lonely people inside .

[Reavern]

5 hours ago, Devil Khan said:

Look, I am not arguing about how bad it is. I've had one since they first were flyable. I stated that there wasn't a quick change as there was a different level. The ship is perfect in it's form. Now stop your bickering.  

Ever think if there was only one door either side instead of two of each module. The only reason I could think was the forward module and access to the turret, which can be changed around. Anyway, what's done is done and I am an owner of a Cater Pillar.

people who call them cats at lonely people inside .

You were doing okay in your first paragraph. But in the second paragraph you once again devolved into incoherent ramblings.

Thank you for proving my point. You admitted that you believe that the CAT is perfect in it's current form. You don't believe it should be changed. Why? I don't know. I don't care. I know that people who resist change are doomed to be left behind. It's called progress. Deal with it. Or don't. I don't care.

You don't seem to understand or remember that all of the ships have changed and evolved since Star Citizen began development 4+ years ago. The Cat will be changed and updated. CIG is developing a more sophisticated flight physics model that is supposed to handle variable mass of ships to accurately simulate the difference in flight performance of an empty ship versus one laden with cargo. The game engine will take into account the mass of the cargo and even its placement inside the ship, and adjust the Cat's flight characteristics accordingly. That improved flight physics model can and will be applied to asymmetric ships, like the Cat, which will give the ship unique flight characteristics. Some players will hate it. Some will like it. Some probably won't even notice or appreciate the difference.

At this time, the Cat is limited to 4 modules, plus the bow module. CIG hasn't released different modules yet, but they will. When it becomes possible to swap out modules, it should also be possible to add or remove modules, instead of being restricted to the standard four. I believe that CIG will amend the 4 module restriction at that time.

Time will tell.

[brandonwillis]

I went back and did the specs on the caterpillar to see just how many of these cyclone and other land vehicles you can fit... references https://cdn.star-citizen.wiki/images/5/55/Drake_Interplanetary_Caterpillar_Broschüre.pdf , https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/16026-Q-A-Tumbril-Cyclone , and other tech data and q&a from robertsspaceindustries.com.

The Caterpillar in all her glory can carry 4 cyclone side facing in each cargo module and two front facing. in the front it can carry 4 front facing and 6 side facing( judging by CR and the way they do things the 2 and three method might be the case!

on to the greycat  the Cat can carry too many of these to count honestly and if it had slightly more underbelly clearance you could stuff two of these on the lift!

The Ursa can fit one in each cargo and by specs two in the front module. and yes with the side lifts the way they are now if you drive onto the with the ursa front facing you can fit it on the lifts just not the left side as the turret would hit the catwalk. If there was not a catwalk at all you could fit two of these as well!.

just wanted to show you guys the digging around I did and what can fit. for those that are like me you could run a ground force out of your Cat and use it as the HQ when landed.

Caterpillar- HQ - unit carrier- front module 3 dragonflies, first cargo ursa, second cargo 2 cyclones, third module greycat and supplies, fourth module swap for med module!

Cutlass red - medical

Cutlass black - troop trans

Cutlass Blue - escort

Buccaneer x2 - escort

just an idea! then you could run security, bounty hunting, and sweeps on the planet surfaces with a small org

 

the smaller version of this would be cat- ursa - cyclone, cyclone tr, 3 dragonflies, and herald.

Use the cat as your baby carrier and the herald to run sweeps and security as an early alert system. It would be nice if the cyclone had like a prison pod set up or life pod setup so you could use for rescue or prisoner transfer!

well thanks for reading my ideas plz share thoughts!

 

[GRIZZ]

 

[GeraldEvans]

Not destroyed enough!

[VoA]

"Samdi"From Samdi's Twitter: Jin working on a bug for the Caterpillar.

[brandonwillis]

We’re doing what we can to ensure that cargo space is also logistically sensible. Cargo squeezed into every nook and cranny of the ship might seem like a win for the player on a numerical side, but the act of loading and unloading will become a pain or even impossible with high ceilings and small doorways. The advantage of the Caterpillar with it’s huge doors will not always be structurally sound for other cargo ships. There may be instances where some ships have potentially ‘useable’ space left over. -source-https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/engineering/16204-The-Shipyard-SCU-And-Cargo-Capacity

[GRIZZ]

Cat explosion galore, so very fine!

[VoA]