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Star citizen HOTAS in trouble?


Elohe

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http://www.polygon.com/2016/2/8/10939752/mad-catz-executive-board-changes-rock-band-4-earnings

It would seem that Mad catz is in deep waters financially. Their CEO quit before earnings report and with short googling it's plain obvious that they've been stuck in the mud for a while now. There still no news if this has any effect to the star citizen HOTAS, but for continued production, quality control and guarantees it would be bad if they go belly up. 

I've been drooling over the star citizen hotas but now I'm bit in doubt. Company this much in trouble is grasping for straws and taking nasty shortcuts often burning the bridges to what's left of their supporters. Then again what are the other options? they are still one of the biggest manufacturers for HOTAS market, there are others, but they tend to be really specific products like Warthog, its great quality, but not optimised for space flight (or gaming as it is a direct copy) and quite much more expensive than even 250$ HOTAS setup we come to expect off the star citizen HOTAS.

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Oh look, a cheap HOTAS being made by a shit company that is now literally "in the shit". Seems like a great idea to buy that.

 

In general using a HOTAS right now puts oyu at a majour disadvantage. I get the immersion factor...but that would be okay if it was a SINGLE PLAYER ONLY game. This is multiplayer as well. Do you think the massive side of people using KBM will care that you cry that you are using the inferior control product because you want immersion?

Just wait it out and see how bad the gap between controllers is before spending a pocketful of cash on something that will piss you right off.

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A CEO leaving always sounds terrible but the finer details are usually lost as the press likes to sensationalize everything.
Let's just see how thing turn out before we go out with pitchforks and torches, alright? :D

If the SC HOTAS doesn't go anywhere.. well, there's some other companies out there still of whom I'm sure some will be very eager to pick up making a system for one of the, if not THE most anticipated games in the world.

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Why is it that EVERY SINGLE physical item that's made for CIG either comes from cheap ass company or a chinese mega factory? I've seen the hats, patches, some of the shirts, and they ALL look like garbage. Idk who is in charge of choosing these companies but for real, you can get custom patches and hats for cheap here and they actually look very good! 

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I own(ed) the RAT 5 and 7 mice from Mad Catz and if they make the SC hotas with the same quality as those "mice", I'm avoiding that hotas like the plague.  The first one rusted within 6 months and then broke down after 1 year of use and I returned the 2nd one because the left click would register twice (and it squeaks too).

 

3 hours ago, Donut said:

Idk who is in charge of choosing these companies but for real, you can get custom patches and hats for cheap here and they actually look very good! 

Honestly, they should give the backers a choice of merchandise and keyboard/hotas manufacturers to let us decide.  Imo regarding the control sticks, I'd pick Logitech... their products might not be the flashiest or best-looking, but damn do they make quality products.  I'm using a G19 since 4 years and a G600 mmo mouse for a year and a half with no problems despite very heavy use.  I also heard that the extreme 3d pro stick, while basic (and has an inappropriately-placed thruster), is renowned for its quality build.

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My 3d Pro extreme is with me for 8 yeras and still going strong.

Saitek... really. I don't give a shit. You hear me Saitek? Get your QA up more than a couple of notches before I would throw money your way. Until then, no and I wouldn't even care if MadCatz go bankrupt or whatever. One less shitty product on the market.

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laying off 37% of your employees usually means the company is having problems ;) I kinda doubt that they will be spending major development dollars on creating The Best Joystick Ever For Starcitizen unless they see it at a low risk investment .... Depends on what their projections are concerning sales of the new joysticks I guess. I think we can safely assume though that their focus will be on the cheaper versions and not the high end OLED touchscreen version unless I am seriously misjudging demand for the high end version :(

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I at one time had a computer software store and madcatz was and is overpriced and break faster than anything else. the only reason they got such a massive market share was they were sold through Wally World (Walmart) by the truckload. I use a 3D pro and a logitech wireless trackball both work great and are not break the bank expensive. I have only replaced the  3D pro once in over 10 years  and I have a WolfKing "Trooper" mouse that I bought with my gaming rig in 2010 it still works fine but I prefer trackballs and I use the Wolfking as my backup mouse. I have been using Logitech trackballs since they first came out, just personal preference but they work great just have to keep them clean. I also used Thrustmaster joysticks, throttles and foot pedals which at one time were a good buy but now also have become way overpriced and the internal springs tend to wear out with any heavy usage and the stick will gain a clear tilt to one side or another. However, personally I think that all the manufacturers really need to improve product quality and become more competitive in their pricing structure, not everyone has a boat load of cash to throw at them or their mommy's purse or daddy's wallet to raid every time some new gizmo hits the market.   

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8 hours ago, CheeseNorris said:

My 3d Pro extreme is with me for 8 yeras and still going strong.

 

6 hours ago, Sean Thornton said:

 I use a 3D pro ... I have only replaced the  3D pro once in over 10 years

I've heard a LOT of people IRL and in other forums/threads saying the exact same thing.  I wonder, knowing how vocal some people can be on the RSI forums, has this ever been brought to CIG's attention? We're going to be playing SC for YEARS, so we better get peripherals that would last just as long.

Because now that I think about it, logitech could make a great deal with CIG.  They could make a SC re-brand of the extreme3d as the basic version of the flight stick and then, instead of increasing the price with a flashy OLED touch screen, how about they use a smartphone connector like the Orion spark keyboard for the advanced version? In other words, an expanded/larger version of the extreme 3d stick, that might or might not connect with the keyboard and has a slot for a smartphone/tablet?

451903-logitech-g910-orion-spark.jpg?thu

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16 hours ago, Donut said:

Why is it that EVERY SINGLE physical item that's made for CIG either comes from cheap ass company or a chinese mega factory? I've seen the hats, patches, some of the shirts, and they ALL look like garbage. Idk who is in charge of choosing these companies but for real, you can get custom patches and hats for cheap here and they actually look very good! 

The green shirt is solid.  HATs not so much.

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17 hours ago, Donut said:

Why is it that EVERY SINGLE physical item that's made for CIG either comes from cheap ass company or a chinese mega factory? I've seen the hats, patches, some of the shirts, and they ALL look like garbage. Idk who is in charge of choosing these companies but for real, you can get custom patches and hats for cheap here and they actually look very good! 

Uuuf so much things are now made in china. The thing is if you want them to make your items in for example Germany, be ready to pay twice as much for that item. Question remains, would that higher price really sell their goodies. It is really hard to compete with china these days. Especially in their current still ongoing crisis, expect china to throw ridiculous low costing deals to dealers. But I'm sure you were already aware of what I just explained :)

I make myself believe that CIG is cutting costs in goodies in order to collect even more money from the goodies to go to the development of the game :D

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On 2/10/2016 at 2:10 AM, Tom Villder said:

 

Honestly, they should give the backers a choice of merchandise and keyboard/hotas manufacturers to let us decide.  Imo regarding the control sticks, I'd pick Logitech... their products might not be the flashiest or best-looking, but damn do they make quality products.  I'm using a G19 since 4 years and a G600 mmo mouse for a year and a half with no problems despite very heavy use.  I also heard that the extreme 3d pro stick, while basic (and has an inappropriately-placed thruster), is renowned for its quality build.

Logitech and Thrustmaster were not interested in doing a limited special HOTAS. CH/APEM basically said that their current sales levels can't justify the R&D and retooling required to design and produce a new stick.

That left... Saitek. They were the only ones who had any interest.

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3 minutes ago, Tom Villder said:

*sigh*

Not even an advanced version of their flight stick?

You have to remember the Warthog is a licensed design. A lot of people don't realize that the design and shape of aircraft flight systems are protected intellectual property, like anything else. 

Making enough changes to it to get around that would require a substantial R&D investment and likely a retooling investment, even if its using the same internal components. And here's the kicker... the stick wouldn't really be any cheaper.. so just who the heck are they going to sell it to? It would have to be really superior to any other high-end HOTAS to get people to replace their Warthogs, VKB, or CH gear with one, which automatically puts it out of the price point of the majority of people who don't already own a HOTAS (if they were willing to spend that much, they'd already have a CHP or TM system, putting them in the first group). So it would be a very expensive niche stick in a niche market.

And that says nothing of the time/money requirement for TARGET.

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4 minutes ago, thekalman said:

You have to remember the Warthog is a licensed design. A lot of people don't realize that the design and shape of aircraft flight systems are protected intellectual property, like anything else. 

Making enough changes to it to get around that would require a substantial R&D investment and likely a retooling investment, even if its using the same internal components. And here's the kicker... the stick wouldn't really be any cheaper.. so just who the heck are they going to sell it to? It would have to be really superior to any other high-end HOTAS to get people to replace their Warthogs, VKB, or CH gear with one, which automatically puts it out of the price point of the majority of people who don't already own a HOTAS (if they were willing to spend that much, they'd already have a CHP or TM system, putting them in the first group). So it would be a very expensive niche stick in a niche market.

And that says nothing of the time/money requirement for TARGET.

Damn... all this stuff about pricing, licensed designs etc is all new to me.  I guess I'll settle with an extreme 3d then.

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On 2/10/2016 at 7:21 PM, Donut said:

Why is it that EVERY SINGLE physical item that's made for CIG either comes from cheap ass company or a chinese mega factory? I've seen the hats, patches, some of the shirts, and they ALL look like garbage. Idk who is in charge of choosing these companies but for real, you can get custom patches and hats for cheap here and they actually look very good! 

Everything is made in China. I have a sweat shop few blocks from my apartment. The conditions are not stellar, so don't expect a new product to be stellar unless the partnership has developed some good guanxi (relationship). Perhaps if these physical items are not up to par with the RSI community, somebody better get down there and start taking some factory bosses out to dinner lol. I would like to go visit this factory for myself someday, believe it's in Guangzhou?

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9 hours ago, Booster Terrik said:

We will probably only see a relatively cheap, fairly low end JS throttle combo from Saitek and the high end one will be cancelled because all enthusiasts will buy high quality boutique stuff and would not touch MadCatz/Saitek with a 10 foot pole ;)

That's pretty much the consensus I've heard from everyone who already has a CH/TM/VKB HOTAS... any Saitek one would have to be epic levels of awesome to get them to even consider replacing their system of choice.

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On 2/12/2016 at 11:43 AM, Booster Terrik said:

I wonder how the new VKB joystick line will pan out, their new gladiator line sure looks promising and the gunfighter line could become great too depending on what they add to it in future : http://www.vkb-sim.pro/viewtopic.php?t=1947

I'm not sure the 'budget' Star Citizen hotas is really going to be anything more than a rebranded Saitek stick -- that's okay if you liked the original but I was hoping for something more like what VKB is offering (without breaking the bank).  When I contacted Stratojet (http://www.gostratojet.com/) VKB's North American distributor for some additional details they provided me the following information on the Gunfighter (premium WWII stick):

" The Gunfighter will come with the plastic grip from our Gladiator stick. It looks like a cheaper KG12. The KG12 grip we intent to make will be all-metal according to VKB and an additional purchase. I don't have prices yet, but you're probably looking at a few hundred for each like our other higher end stuff. And I don't have an ETA yet. VKB has lots of plans, but short on firm dates. I'm trying to keep them on the straight path to production of already announced products. "  - February 3rd, 2016

As for the Gladiator (which I'm leaning to now), here was the last available info I had on that one (No price known as of Feb 16th, 2016): http://forum.il2sturmovik.com/topic/19229-vkb-stratojet-gladiator-update-and-fat-black-mamba-mkiii/

I'm still pretty interested in VKB's offerings but have never seen (or known anyone whose seen) one of these sticks and had a chance to try it out.  Anyone here get the Black Mamba Mark III?  The new metal gimble sounds promising but seams to be getting mixed reviews on-line over the last month.  It's a hard decision to make with the pre-order for VKB and Star Citizen coming up at different times from each other and the general lack of info on either unit.

 

 

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